Jeremy Dyer: From Active Investor To Passive Investor To Capital Raiser

LISTEN TO THE FULL EPISODE ON:

For many, fixing and flipping is the way into real estate investing which is the same for Jeremy Dyer. After becoming rookie of the year working with ADP and having a lot of success in his sales job, Jeremy was looking for a way to take advantage of all of the amazing benefits being a real estate investor can bring. He did fix and flips for 3 years and became exhausted over all of the work and stress of having, what felt like, a second job. He then found the benefits of becoming a passive investor into larger deals through syndication and was hooked. He could experience the rewards of investing in real estate without all of the day to day work. This has allowed him to be a passive investor in 24 deals with over 4,000 doors and over $400 Million in assets. This consists of investing in 8 states in 4 different asset classes with 6 sponsors.

Today, Jeremy has taken that experience as a passive investor and great relationships with many highly compensated sales professionals and turned it into becoming a capital raiser himself, helping to raise capital for some of the same deals he's investing in. Hear Jeremy talk about his journey, the launch of Starting Point Capital, and how he's able to accomplish all of this and still have time for his wife & 4 children while being a passive real estate investor.

In this episode hosted by Mike Swenson, we discussed:

• How Jeremy learned about syndication at the time when they decided to exit the active fix and flip business
• Jeremy's first decision to invest passively into a real estate syndication in 2016
• How Jeremy transitioned to investing on passive level, and how his life has changed
• The importance of integrity, track record, transparency, and communication style in a sponsor you're investing with
• Things to look for in analyzing your syndication deal
• How Jeremy's 24 deals are in 8 different states in 4 different asset classes with 6 sponsors through diversification of sponsor and market
• Loving the strategy and evangelizing the strategy in transitioning to starting point capital

Timestamps:

0:00 - Intro To Jeremy's Career
1:24 - From Active Fix and Flip Business to Passive Real Estate Syndication
6:51 - The Aha Moment
11:20 - What Should You Look For in a Sponsor
14:38 - Analyzing Numbers In A Syndication Deal
19:02 - Balancing The Due Diligence + Working With The Operator
20:59 - Guide To Decision Making
23:20 - Getting Into Learning Acceleration
26:28 - Raising Investor Capital: Process and How It Works
31:33 - How To Level Up Yourself Each Day
33:25 - Establishing Your Investor Avatar
34:16 - How To Find Jeremy

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Minnesota Real Estate

Read the full transcript here:

Mike Swenson
Welcome to The REL Freedom Podcast where we inspire you to pursue your passion to gain time and financial freedom through opportunities in real estate. I'm your host, Mike Swenson. Let's get some REL freedom together.

Mike Swenson
Hello, everybody, and welcome to another episode of The REL Freedom Podcast where we talk about building time and financial freedom through opportunities in real estate. And I'm really excited about today's guests. For you. We've got Jeremy Dyer, Jeremy is going to have a very unique perspective that we haven't necessarily had on the show before. Jeremy works a W two job. So right out of college, you worked with a sales career move to the top of the company actually kind of entered in real estate as an investor as a passive investor, and have invested in 4000 doors and 24 deals, we'll talk more about that private equity of over $400 million in total assets. But then now you're at the point where you're raising capital. And so you're still working your W two job, you are a passive investor and now starting to raise capital hailing from Minnesota, we have to give props to another Minnesotan on the show. Jeremy Dyer, we're so excited to have you.

Jeremy Dyer
Mike, thank you for having me.

Mike Swenson
Why don't you just go ahead and just walk us through your journey of getting into investing and then exploring real estate as an investment opportunity?

Jeremy Dyer
Yeah, I'd be happy to thank you for that. So I really got started in real estate after I had risen to the top of the charts, so to speak, in my professional day job. So for a number of years now, I've been a high achieving sales professional. And it got to a point in my mid 20s, where I had reached a point where I kind of quintessentially had everything I needed, so to speak, right, I had the dream home, paid off, married, had two children, two more were on their way. So we went from two to four, had the 40 foot RV sitting in the driveway. And I was, you know, really kind of at the pinnacle, so to speak of my financial life at that time. And I also had a burning desire to get into the real estate industry by actively owning and managing real estate properties. So my wife and I decided, while our kids were young that we were going to start up a fix and flip business. And we did that my wife had a knack for interior design. My dad was a general contractor, and we fixed and flip houses, some of which we rented out others, you know, we walked away with 20 3040 $50,000 in additional equity, you know, through those reposition efforts. The challenge was a few years into that in order to scale that business, we were going to really have to increase the amount of homes that we were flipping on an annual basis or rentals that we were taking into our rental portfolio. So the challenge we had at the time was is that my older two older boys are active and year round sports. The two younger ones, you know, we're starting to get active in their different activities and sporting events. And we were realising that the real estate side on the active side was really becoming a second full time job for me, and I was just simply spread too thin. I certainly could have managed the second business and likely have done it well. But it would have been at the direct sacrifice of not spending time watching my kids grow up. Okay, so my wife and I decided back in 2015 that we were going to exit the active fix and flip business and instead focus on our family. While at the same time I learned about real estate syndications. Okay, at the time, I didn't even know what the word syndication meant, other than I knew the Green Bay Packers were a syndicated football team. Okay. So back in 2015 2016, I made my first decision to invest passively as a limited partner into a real estate syndication. I use the what I call the shotgun approach. I held my breath and I plugged my nose I sent in my six figure wire transfer. And three years later, I had doubled my money in that particular investment and from that point forward, I was hooked on the strategy. So now fast forward from that first moment in 2015 and 2016 to today 2023. I'm now a limited partner investor or passive investor in 24 different investments most of which are in the multifamily space. However, I have also explored other asset classes like self storage, assisted living, flex office, and retail to name a few. And because I have really fallen in love with that type of an investing strategy, it has all afforded me the ability to start to raise investor capital for sponsors that are looking to acquire additional multifamily assets. And that's really where my side hustle, which is known as starting point capital was birth, which starting point capital exists for the sole purpose of educating other investors on the investing strategy in real estate syndications, and really helping sponsors to raise that capital that they need to acquire those assets.

Mike Swenson
Yeah, that's a lot of stuff. And just to hear you talk about it all, you know, you've got a high pain sales job, you've got a family, they're very involved in sports and other activities. And to be able to have your side hustle, be that extensive, really speaks to I think the tenacity with which you attack things. I think for a lot of people, you know, that was that was one of the aha moments I had was I had interviewed a guy who was actively investing in real estate, I think he had a four Plex. And he was talking about how there was a weekend, the unit needed to be turned, and he took the entire weekend and painted that unit. And he said, I looked up, you know, he had a he had a family and kids and he's like, you know, I've got 52 weekends in a year. And I just burned one painting a unit to be able to turn it with the whole point of doing this for my family. So I'm taking time away from my family, which kind of counter you know, was counterintuitive. The idea of, I want to be able to spend more time with my family. So obviously, passive real estate investment, you saw that as an opportunity of okay, I don't have to be hands on. I don't have to personally talk to the property manager or do all that stuff myself. So talk about kind of that that moment of realisation where you're like, oh, I can still achieve my financial goals, and not have to do the toilets and all that kind of stuff at the same time.

Jeremy Dyer
Yeah, that's a really good question. I would say that my aha moment took place when we had acquired and fix and flipped our last property. Okay. And 30 days out from being ready to put that property on the market, we learned that the septic system had failed, okay. And for the low low price of $35,000, which ate directly into the profits, okay, the profit margin that we were looking to achieve on that particular asset was gone, okay, in the blink of an eye. So that was really our kind of aha moment. Second to that is we had had enough track record at that point, with other properties that we were actively fixing, flipping that I knew what the margins were, okay, at least the margins that we were able to achieve, relative to the amount of effort that we had to put forth to achieve that, that margin, so to speak, right. So one of the one of the aha moments then is once I got into investing passively into real estate syndications, I realised very quickly that I get very similar tax benefits, I receive very similar, you know, depreciation benefits as a direct result of of passively investing into those assets. And also, I received, you know, very much similar on the equity side, the forest and natural appreciation that I was receiving through the fix and flip efforts, right, and the cashflow. And ultimately, when those deals were going full cycle, you know, the equity split that I would receive when those when those properties went full cycle was was very similar to the amount of capital that I was putting in as an active real estate investor in those single family fix and flips you highlighted

Mike Swenson
well, and to being able to offset your regular income and your W two job, you know, I'm curious to learn more like when you're talking with other high paid sales executives, what are those conversations like to be able to say, look, I've got these assets here that are offsetting this income from my for my tax benefits? Is it kind of this aha moment where like, oh, my gosh, I need to be putting more money into real estate to to take care of that, you know, that benefit that you receive?

Jeremy Dyer
Yeah, great question, Mike. You know, I would say that, for myself included, the investors that I talk with on a regular basis, are really more so after time, freedom, that's the one thing that none of us can create. And that is more time. I can always create more money, okay, I can always spend more time in my w two jobs to create a higher w two for myself. I can always start one side hustle two side hustles are 10 side hustles right, we can always create more money, right? The one thing that we cannot create more of is time freedom. We all only have a certain amount of time in our lives, okay. And so for me, the big you know, pull to doing it on a passive level where I'm trusting the spots To execute the business plan versus myself, was a huge draw to me to know that I wouldn't have to spend more of my precious time away from my children and my wife and growing my family. But rather, I could turn that capital over to a sponsor that I didn't just know, like and trust. But a sponsor that I knew would be a would be a good fiduciary of my capital, right capital preservation, and where I felt confident and comfortable in the market and the strategy, and really that sponsor being able to hit the Return projections that they projected to investors, when they originally rolled out that opportunity.

Mike Swenson
Let's dig a little bit deeper to that, because you have had an experience seen lots of sponsors, having seen deals come all the way through the lifecycle, and being able to either choose to place your money with them again, or to say, You know what, thanks that we had a good time now I'm gonna go to somebody else. So talk about what you're looking for in a sponsor, and some of those key pieces for you to say, Yeah, my money's my money's good here. It's more than like you said, just the know, like and trust. It's, I've seen them execute on this time and time again, and I feel like my money is going to hit that target better than what I might find in some other sponsors deals.

Jeremy Dyer
Yeah, good question, I would say that a lot of it comes down to the integrity of the sponsor, which it takes time to learn what that integrity level looks like. Second to that is going to be their their track record, and their transparency, both of which are incredibly important. So as I, I, as I evaluate other sponsors that are in the space, and other deals that those sponsors are presenting, you know, I'm really looking at a couple of primary things outside of, you know, going through the pro forma, and coming to the conclusion that the sponsors projections are going to be met. Right? That's a really a crystal ball question more than anything, but, you know, on the top of my list are really what is that sponsors track record, right? How many deals have they had that have gone full cycle? Okay, what are the returns look like to their limited partner investors on those opportunities? If the sponsor has had some rough patches, which I hope that they all have had, I would like to know about them. Okay. The one thing that's true in the real estate business, is it has a tendency to fall apart on a lot of different levels. I'm stealing this from one of my colleagues, but birds fly fish, swim, and real estate just has a tendency to fall apart. Okay. It's just what happens in the business. So I want to know that the sponsor that I'm investing with has really been battle tested, you know, did they go through the oh, 809 global financial crisis? Okay. Did they survive the COVID? You know, crisis, right? Did they have a deal that maybe struggled to meet their debt service coverage ratio? Right? Did they have a deal that struggled with occupancy? Okay, do they have a deal right now, that has a floating rate bridge loan, and they're struggling to make interest payments on that on that loan? Right. So I really want to know that I'm working with a sponsor that has that proven track record has been battle tested. And more than that, I want to know what their communication style is. Okay. So does the sponsor communicate with their investors on a monthly basis, a quarterly basis? And are they willing to tell their limited partner investors, not just the good news and paint this optimistic picture of the future? But are they willing to tell their limited partner investors the challenges that they've had in the last 30 days since they sent out their last investor communication?

Mike Swenson
Absolutely. And curious to know when you're talking about analysing the numbers, you want somebody that's going to tell you the truthful story versus kind of the pie in the sky story. So for people that don't know, when you're analysing syndication deals, you've got kind of the the breakdown, the performers, the projected returns, and you know, those numbers are just projections, right. And so how do you know whether I'm going to get that I'm gonna get less than that more that you might have somebody that wants to pump up the numbers so they can get your money, you might have somebody that wants to under promise and over deliver. So talk about kind of analysing those numbers.

Jeremy Dyer
Yeah, it's funny that you say that because oftentimes, I see on investor pitch decks, you know, the expected exit cap rate on a deal, right? Well, if your projected hold time is five years, how on earth are you able to project an exit cap rate being 5.5 or six, right? What I'd rather see in a An investor pitch deck is something that provides an exit an exit cap rate range, right? You know, this is what the return profile would look like at a four cap, a five cap, a six cap, a seven and a half cap, right. But really, at the end of the day, when a limited partner investor is looking at the projections, Kay, it's garbage in garbage out. Right. So a couple of things that I like to really look at right away, when I'm looking at the pro forma and evaluating the deal. Is the rent growth. Okay, is that is the projected rent growth in line with what the local competitive assets in that market are going to be able to achieve? Is the sponsor expecting 20% rent growth year over year? Or are they more realistic in a maybe four to 6% range? That's one thing that I look at right away, and most good sponsors will provide what those competitive assets in that same market are receiving right now for a new and improved product, right. Second to that is not only just job growth in that particular market, right, because it's not just about the sponsor, it's also about the market that that asset is located in, because there's one thing that you and I both know you can't do in real estate, and that is you can't move the asset to a different market, right. So we're kind of stuck in that market with that particular investment. So I like to see not only realistic job growth projections, but also job diversification. Right? We see what happened in Detroit, for example, during the automotive crisis, right? There wasn't a lot of job diversification in the Detroit market. So I like to see not just job growth, realistic projections, but also job diversification. Obviously, I like to evaluate the insurance costs, right. Sometimes sponsors will acquire an asset and not realise that after year one, the property management fees go up 2030 40%, depending upon the market, right? Are they projecting a higher increase in insurance costs, knowing that if they project high enough, the hope is, obviously those numbers are less than what they're projecting? Or are they projecting something that's just completely unrealistic for that market? I also like to know about the financing structure right now, it's kind of a big, big news story right now, you know, with where interest rates start at. So I'd like to know, is it fixed rate for how many years that is an interest only? Right? You know, what's their? What's their plan, in the hopefully unlikely case that interest rates continue to rise in the future, right? Have they stress tested that particular asset at multiple different interest rate, interest rate levels. And then lastly, I'd like to know about the new development absorption rate. Okay, I'd like to know about those competitive assets that are in that same market that are ground up construction, right, and what those absorption rates look like. So if a new developer is putting in 160 unit apartment building in that same market, and they started construction two years ago, by now they should have a generally a good idea as to what that absorption rate looks like, if that absorption rate is 60%. That's a red flag. Right? If that absorption rate is 95%, then more than likely, I know that there's still a high demand in that particular market for multifamily apartments,

Mike Swenson
you know, we talked about time, right? And you know, wanting to be able to minimise your time as much having invested in 24 different deals, how much of this is you doing your own due diligence? How much of it is you working with your operator doing their due diligence, because obviously, to your, you're gonna still need to verify what they present to you. And how much of it is maybe wanting to lean into a handful of markets, hey, I really like the States, I really liked the cities. So for somebody that wants to pursue this, maybe you're looking at your first deal, your first couple of deals here. It's like, gosh, it seems overwhelming to be in all these different markets, all these different assets. How do you kind of take that time to balance the due diligence plus working with the operator and what they're sharing?

Jeremy Dyer
Yeah, that's a really good question. glad that you brought it up. And certainly, you need to be able to trust the sponsor. And you can say trust, I trust a lot of people, okay, in my life, but there's a lot of people I would never trust to, you know, put $20 million on an apartment, you know, with a CapEx budget and hope to produce a 20% internal rate of return to their investors over three to five years. Right. So there's that side of it as well, which comes with the experience level. So you know, certainly trust but verify my strategy when it comes to investing into real estate as a passive investor is all about diversification. Okay? It's not just about diversification of sponsor, but it's also diversification of market. Okay, so the 24 deals that I'm a limited partner investor in right now are in eight different states in four different asset classes with six different sponsors. Okay, I'm a Big fan of the same strategy that your financial advisor would give you as it relates to investing in Wall Street. And that is to diversify, whether it's amongst small cap stocks or large cap stocks. So when investors come to me, and they've got additional cash on the sidelines, otherwise known as dry powder, and they're looking to invest that money passively into real estate, some of which, by the way, come on into the active space. And they're done dealing with tenants, trash toilets, and termites. And so they want to move that capital into passive real estate investments. Oftentimes, I'll encourage them not to put all their money into my next, you know, opportunity that I might be raising capital for that maybe to slice and dice up that in chunks into multiple different properties that become available over the over the coming months or coming years.

Mike Swenson
You know, it's nice being at the spot of 24 different assets being able to split that out. But if I'm choosing my first one or two, how would you maybe guide their decision making?

Jeremy Dyer
Yeah, good question. I guess, you know, first of all, you've got to identify a sponsor, with that proper track record, that has a huge alignment of interest, okay, when I see alignment of interest, I want to make sure that that sponsor is putting some of their own capital into the deal. Okay, what I like to see is I like to see a sponsor that is putting up at least five to 10% of their own money into that particular opportunity that they're looking to raise investor capital for. Second to that, I want to make sure that my limited partner investment, okay, or my passive investment, sits next in line from the senior debt. Okay. What I mean by that is, there's not a second party that gets paid first in what's called the waterfall. Okay, so there's a difference between a Class A and Class B share. As an example, I want to make sure that my investment does not sit behind the class a share, which is usually just a preferred return, that gets paid out to the limited partner investors, where a Class B share would be equity plus cash flow, right. So I want to make sure that my investment sits directly behind that senior debt. And I want to make sure that my particular investment also has a preferred return, that I am not guaranteed because nothing is guaranteed in real estate. But I want to make sure that a preferred return exists of around seven to 8%, that I get paid annually, cumulatively before the sponsor receives a split on that profit.

Mike Swenson
Yeah, and I know, that's something that, you know, we were at a luncheon together, and you'd mentioned that about the Burford return being key, because you want to experience that quick win. If I'm putting up a large chunk of money, I want to be able to see something coming back right away. So talk about then the seeds that were planted, as you're getting more and more experienced, as an investor looking up saying, Hey, I might be interested in raising some capital. So talk about that journey of kind of seed being planted to your intense learning curve of I know, you went through a pretty serious time where like, I'm committed to this to where you're at today.

Jeremy Dyer
Yeah, great question. So I would say that, that, you know, learning acceleration really started back in 2021, where I realised the power of real estate investing, not necessarily as the only way to invest, but certainly a way that not many people that are higher income individuals are currently participating in mostly because they're unaware of that particular investing strategy. Most people's perception of investing is almost exclusive to either Wall Street, whatever their financial advisor tells them, or they believe that they're already in real estate because of the home that they live in. Right. So that's really the extent of most higher net worth individuals understanding, you know, of real estate, or they believe that they need to go buy, you know, grandma's house, down the road stick 50 grand into it, rent it out and hope that they receive 300 bucks a month in profit, an asset that they're going to spend, you know, countless hours in the evenings and weekends, you know, on as an active investor. So, my, my transition really to starting point capital existed out of my love for the strategy number one, and then number two, me kind of wanting to evangelise other people quite frankly, on the strategy, and I became so in love with it, that I set up a website to educate people on the on the strategy, and obviously I would talk to all my friends and family and colleagues and coworkers and just anybody that I've met, you know about what I was up to, and how it impacted my own life. So really, that's how starting point capital existed. But I started building up a network of people that I was referring to other sponsors, right? Pro bono referring them, it got to a point where I realised, hey, maybe there's a side hustle business that I could form, which is there to exist, which exists to help educate people on this type of investing strategy, while also helping sponsors with with one big thing that they need. And that is they need investor capital, in order to acquire these properties and implement their value add business plan,

Mike Swenson
I remember listening to somebody that that was raising capital for a deal, and they were talking about how, you know, fast forward, he's like, if you can raise capital, and pretty much write your own check to whatever you want to do, because people are going to need money, he's like, for me, that goal is, you know, it's great to be able to raise to be able to then manage the asset, but he's like, kind of, ideally, the best thing would be is just to raise money and to be able to cash that check. And then I don't have to worry about the asset management piece, you know, because if you can raise money, you've got a lot of freedom and what you can do, and you can go raise money for anything, it doesn't have to be real estate, it could be businesses, you name it. And so talk through because I know you raise for a couple of different funds, but talk about that process and how that works. So there's a

Jeremy Dyer
couple of different ways that you can raise investor Capital One is by becoming a co general partner, you know, on the deal, where you show material participation in the execution of the business plan, and there's a number of boxes that need to be checked, you know, there from a compliance perspective. Another one is through something called a special purpose vehicle or SPV. It's a fun to funds model, where the capital raiser essentially sets up a fund and collects investor capital into that fund. And then that fund deploys that capital into the investment, many sponsors and syndicators that are that have any degree of volume, they typically like that fund of funds model better because I'm essentially writing one single large check to the investment on behalf of my investors versus those investors all going retail directly into the deal. So a lot of larger sponsors, like the fact that I'm basically a fund manager, I'm an extension of their syndication team, as a investor relations person, and I am able to have that relationship, so to speak with that limited partner investor, which in the real estate syndication piece is incredibly important that the limited partner passive investor has a pre existing relationship with somebody that's a part of that of that sponsor level or syndication team.

Mike Swenson
And one of the themes that I hear throughout your story is it's it's relationships, right? building good relationships with your operators, building good relationships with other investors, referring them, all your your freebie, referrals that you gave people now being able to take that capital and say, Look, that relational capital and saying, Look, if you trust me, here's another opportunity that's out there. And so it's the power of building and strengthening those relationships and providing solutions for what people are looking for.

Jeremy Dyer
Yeah, that's right. And I get asked that question a lot, because I'm, I would consider myself a self proclaimed capital raising Rookie of the Year, okay, again, self proclaimed, right? So others might argue with me on that, but many people asked me, you know, how is it that you were able to be successful in the capital raising space, while not really having to allocate a tremendous amount of time towards it, the time aspect can easily be addressed by the fact that I'm also personally investing into those deals myself. So I've already vetted that opportunity, and I'm willing to put my own capital into that project. And with starting point capital, I am really giving you the opportunity to invest alongside me into that same opportunity. And why is it that so many people have kind of followed me into those investments is really just comes down to one word, and that's reputation. Okay. It's taken me over two decades, in my professional career, to build up the reputation to the point where now, when people learn about what I'm up to, they just desire to want to know more, right? And because of the reputation that I've built up with others over the years, right, my internal stock price with those individuals has increased. They know me as somebody that they like and trust and has integrity, right and is willing to look out for them, you know, so to speak. So I would just say that for any sponsors that are in this space that might be looking to raise capital or listen to this episode. I would, I would say that more more than anything, you need to become a better version of yourself. And we all have room and areas to improve in that department. Okay? None of us are perfect. But there's daily steps and daily action items that we can take every day to become a better version of ourselves. And if we do, genuinely, more people are going to want to know more about what you're up to, and likely going to want to participate in those opportunities alongside you as well.

Mike Swenson
Yeah, and what would you say are maybe some of those key things for you that you're focusing on to essentially level up yourself each day?

Jeremy Dyer
I would say right now I'm really trying to learn how to be a more effective communicator, not necessarily an a verbal communicator, because I've done a lot of that over my years in my professional job, but it's really on the written side. So really finding out ways in which I can provide value to people through the wit written word, and getting that information out to people through social media platforms through an e book that I'm currently in the process of developing, right through my LinkedIn, you know, connections, so really trying to find any way that I can to educate people, not necessarily with an opportunity to invest into a future deal, but ways that I can educate them about the space that I'm in, so that I'm providing value to them, which also includes, by the way, recommending podcasts and books and so forth, that that exists out there from others.

Mike Swenson
You know, one of the things that I love is when when I'm working with real estate agents that want to get into real estate, or they they're coming from another industry, and it's like I'm doing this job in sales, or I'm doing this job and as a teacher, whatever it might be. And now I want to get in real estate. And we talk a lot about leveraging your transferable skills, skills that you have in your previous industry that you can now use here. And for somebody like you that has so many great people skills, sales skills that you've used to become rookie of the year to become top of your company. Now, when you're a passive investor, you're placing your money with people. And you're you're still building trust and building those relationships. But now when it comes to capital raising, you're really taking all the transferable skills that you've learned in your entire business career. And now you're just applying it in a different way towards a different thing. And so you're somebody that can step right in and be successful because of all those transferable skills that you have in your other industry.

Jeremy Dyer
Absolutely. 100% agree with that. The transferable skills piece, the other side of it is is you know, I've really tried to identify what my investor avatar is, right? You know, I would say that my avatar is not an investor that is a professional engineer, or a doctor or an airline pilot, right? You know, the industry that I have known for the last two decades and where I know a lot of others is really in the professional zero sales career, which sometimes can be people like real estate agents, right? or really anybody that would be considered a high achieving sales professional, those are really the people that identify you know, the best with and they're also the people that identify most with my story as well.

Mike Swenson
So for people that want to learn more about starting point, capital, or even just kind of real estate syndications, how can they get a hold of you and reach out and learn more?

Jeremy Dyer
I'm relatively active on LinkedIn so your audience can look me up there under Jeremy Dyer. And then I have a website starting point capital.com Again, that starting point capital.com

Mike Swenson
Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Jeremy, for coming on and sharing your perspective both as kind of that passive investor early on to now being active yourself and best of luck to you as you continue to grow in raising capital and, and placing it with amazing investments. Mike, thank you for having me on the show.

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